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| Sazzle
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 12 Mar 2006 | | Posts: 219 | | : | | Location: The depths of selly oak |
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 Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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| JulienP wrote: | | Well he's right, tis all about openness and clarity! It is our Guild after all is it not? |
I don't usually jump at the chance to be bitchy but at the moment it doesnt feel, act or jump at me as "our" guild. I will get a horrible reply from this but what the hell.....
The guild governance thing - who's decided it? NOT GC thats for sure. The exec? well a few members - with a vote it seems forced to have been put at the end of a Resources meeting.
Such a fundamental thing has been taken out of the hands of the students, put forward to University Council (which will be hard if not irreparable to go back on) and all in the name of "democracy" which i cannot and still cant see at any point in the process.
To me being our Guild is about having the opportunity to get views together and make a change that benefits us all and is what we have asked for. Granted GC is not the perfect forum as Gary constantly tells us it is the best thing we have to represent the views of all 28,000-30,000 students at this university. It is the only forum where students views can be collectively heard, without it student democracy so to speak wouldn't happen in such a prominent form.
Is it "our" Guild - i could rant for hours *sigh*
* I think i ranted on the wrong page * |
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| JulienP
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 04 Mar 2006 | | Posts: 463 | | : | | Location: Selly Park, Birmingham |
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2007 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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You're absolutely right Sazzle, my comment was tongue in cheek. Showing how far our ideals are from the practice, as you have so elequently shown.
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| naivehottie
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 01 Apr 2006 | | Posts: 385 | | : | |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 10:55 am Post subject: |
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conveniently Guild governance couldn't be discussed, not sure the reasons though.
Finally we've seen Guild Council hold an exec member to account, chucking Ryan off only maybe 3 Guild Councils too late. Good to see Sid stay on as there are double standards enforced towards him, when Jennifer Larbie or Tomi never do reports and get away with it every time (admittedly they do stuff for their constituents which is good, so glad they're not up for being chucked off).
Have to say I'm impressed I spoke for my own censure and still didn't get one. Also got my first warning, for voting of all things.
Hopefully Josh Miller gets Indy Chair |
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| JulienP
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 04 Mar 2006 | | Posts: 463 | | : | | Location: Selly Park, Birmingham |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 11:52 am Post subject: |
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Does he know you nominated him? And James on that point what were you thinking? He didn't have a chance.
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| naivehottie
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 01 Apr 2006 | | Posts: 385 | | : | |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah I told him I was planning to.
He still won't be last, Tom Brown will probably get less votes, he stood for Indy Chair three times in one meeting which is impressive, he seems to be becoming the new Lee Whittaker |
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| Sazzle
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 12 Mar 2006 | | Posts: 219 | | : | | Location: The depths of selly oak |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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| naivehottie wrote: | Yeah I told him I was planning to.
He still won't be last, Tom Brown will probably get less votes, he stood for Indy Chair three times in one meeting which is impressive, he seems to be becoming the new Lee Whittaker |
You know that with doin so you prevented people asking questions which were actually very important?
What a waste of time! |
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| Parsley
Indymedia Hound
| | Joined: 11 Feb 2007 | | Posts: 15 | | : | |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 1:30 pm Post subject: |
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Last night was the second GC in a row that has seen attempts to shut down the meeting as soon as we got onto the motions. I appreciated why in each case (it was 11pm in March, it was Laura's birthday last night and she was chairing alone, and exam season etc etc) but I think this is becoming a rather dangerous trend. We are being left able to scrutinise our exec for hours about what they have done (great- no problems) but left very little opportunity to decide what we actually want them to do in the first pace. In both instances it was exec members who tried to close the meeting.
Before I get accused of it, I am definately not suggesting that this was an attempt by exec to "stifle democracy", for there were good reasons each time, but if the attempts had been successful we would have been unable to mandate them to do anything for a full two months... and that's a long time. |
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| pmqs
Street Demonstrator
| | Joined: 09 Oct 2006 | | Posts: 78 | | : | | Location: Birmingham |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 1:49 pm Post subject: |
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closing the meeting is a f**k disgrace at a voluntary-attendance event
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| JulienP
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 04 Mar 2006 | | Posts: 463 | | : | | Location: Selly Park, Birmingham |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Before I get accused of it, I am definately not suggesting that this was an attempt by exec to "stifle democracy" |
What would you call it then? In a less crude manner I agree with pmqs. At an event where attendance is voluntary and, like you yourself say, next chance was some time away, closing the meeting can only be a bad thing.
If I am honest, there is a case to be made for having shorter meetings more often.
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| higuy
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 02 Mar 2006 | | Posts: 301 | | : | |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 2:50 pm Post subject: |
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| pmqs wrote: | | closing the meeting is a f**k disgrace at a voluntary-attendance event |
err no - sometimes its the right thing to do
take the meetin two GCs ago when the last motion was on display boards. This affected societies, association, standing societies and more. And there were 29 people left in the room. Such an issue - something that needs engagement from everyone and all the above - cannot satisfactorily be decided.
We need to dispense with a lot of the procedure - and if i may say so - the indi chairs need to feel assured enough to know they're chairing the meeting - within reason their in charge. Full credit for Charlton telling Brown to shut up when he tried to star the whole agenda. Sometimes we stick to the procedure so rigidly... I know you will all think im trying to undermine democracy... but we waste to so much time!
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| JulienP
Black Bloc
| | Joined: 04 Mar 2006 | | Posts: 463 | | : | | Location: Selly Park, Birmingham |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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Gordon Bennett, I actually agree with Marley on his second point. The indie chairs do need to be more powerful, they have the power, use it! They should not be afraid to bang down anyone in the room, from the President to a GCer-newbie.
| Quote: | | take the meetin two GCs ago when the last motion was on display boards. This affected societies, association, standing societies and more. And there were 29 people left in the room. Such an issue - something that needs engagement from everyone and all the above - cannot satisfactorily be decided. |
Hmmmm, but closing the meeting means those issues don't get discussed, at all. Or they got shoved to the next meeting, which then piles up with stuff, so that one if long too, and we start all over again. Shorter meetings more often. Emergency meetings for big things like Guild Governance. There are ways round this problem other than shutting meetings down.
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| SimonM
Black Bloc
 | | Joined: 16 Feb 2006 | | Posts: 327 | | : | | Location: Selly Oak |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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The results are in - the independent chairs for 2007/08 will be:
Hannah Lazell
Fabian Guy Neuner
Will Stevens
Congratulations to them!
Also, for anyone who missed it, Peter Lloyd won the by-election to become an indy chair for the remainder of the 2006/07 term (until the end of July). |
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| pmqs
Street Demonstrator
| | Joined: 09 Oct 2006 | | Posts: 78 | | : | | Location: Birmingham |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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was 'enlighted bystander' a prophecy?
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| hannoir
Black Bloc
 | | Joined: 22 Jan 2006 | | Posts: 339 | | : | | Location: in a hole |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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cheers guys for the support
hopefully ill take your concerns on board to improve GC...
(i may be a little drunk)
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/hannoir/ - check out my photos.... |
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| sallamino
Black Bloc
 | | Joined: 17 Feb 2006 | | Posts: 101 | | : | |
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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| JulienP wrote: | | Quote: | | Before I get accused of it, I am definately not suggesting that this was an attempt by exec to "stifle democracy" |
What would you call it then? In a less crude manner I agree with pmqs. At an event where attendance is voluntary and, like you yourself say, next chance was some time away, closing the meeting can only be a bad thing.
If I am honest, there is a case to be made for having shorter meetings more often. |
oh come on people. Last time round people were concerned about how sensible it was to keep a meeting going after 11pm especially after a long debate. I disagreed, and I belive spoke in favour of keeping it open - but it was a valid argument.
this time round, I proposed closing. Not to stifle debate, or to avoid anyone mandating me to do anything, but to make people aware that everything they discussed from that point forward would have to be ratified, that it was the lone chair's birthday and perhaps she would like a break, and in sympathy for all the people who I know were their despite impending exams. Guild council disagreed and continued the meeting which is fine, but giving the option to have it discussed in those circumstances I really dont believe is stifling debate. Its a voluntary meeting yes, but plenty of people feel an obligation or duty to be there, and giving them a chance to voice a preference is not all that undemocratic  |
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